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How I feel Slayer should be...

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  • How I feel Slayer should be...

    Let us go back to how Slayer was and how it should be. It was the warrior that had the least HP but the survivability came from evasion.
    The class should have high single target damage. It's a single target DD, not AoE. It's also not supposed to be a tank. When Shadowforged came to how it is, increasing the Max HP by P.Atk and M.Atk it was as stupid as Sadism on VM. I'd be in favour of removing this skill and replacing it with something else, or reworking it to something like increasing evasion based on P.Atk and M.Atk. If that is not possible, then drop it right down. Boosting the skill, whilst increasing the P.Atk and M.Atk the class could get was again not thought through.

    Increase Oblivion. This skill doesn't offer enough threat reduction. Slayer shouldn't be taking agro, it's not a tank. People need to get out of this mind set.
    To make it fair for all Slayers, it should have a fixed threat reduction. EG: 75%. The skill level should then do nothing more but boost the duration. Either that, or have a base of X% and have the skill increase the % by 1 or 2..

    It needs to stop being compared to other classes. It's not an AoE DD, it never has been and IMO never should be.
    Hellstorm is fine as it is. Leave it. Apocalypse has always been a weak AoE, could it be boosted? Probably, yes. But it should keep a longer CD. Don't turn Slayer into Merc version 2. Wild Stream is also a broken skill.

    Rework Pact with Darkness. Remove the Max HP it gives and swap it with another stat (Please not crit power...). Perhaps P.Acc?

    After Image never procs. Keep it a low chance, but at least make it work. (Only if you remove the stupid HP the class can get. Otherwise it's a boost that the class doesn't need because it will just give it even more HP for the duration).

    Envenom is also broken. I lost additional damage when I swapped from +25 Circus to +25 Island. Since Jordan was kind enough to make the Island daggers +25 for me, I am able to swap between the two, so the only thing that changes are the weapons. At one point, the damage on the Island daggers dropped down to +6k. But switching back to the Circus daggers gave me +77k.

    Leave Phase Blades as it is. I don't think it's fair if a class can get 100% P.Ignore without Endairon. I've seen that idea thrown out there and I do not agree with it, at all. The P.Atk the class has is really high, but it should be.

    Slayer should be the warrior equivalent of VM, but single target not AoE. It should have slightly less damage than VM because it has the P.Def boost. (Ok, the 175/185 armour sets go against this point, but I hope they rework them. I already saw this comment in the feedback thread for the Epic so I didn't bother posting. The single target damage between the two is quite close at end game. If you take into account the AoE damage from VM, then it wipes the floor with Slayer. But. They should only be able to do this if they have a tank holding the agro. Jordan told me that he can kill in S3 Devildom, but so far can only pull about 3 mobs at a time. He should be able to improve this whilst he adjusts to the play style of that class.

    I also think people need to stop comparing other classes to Slayer. I've seen it in-game of comments of "This class needs to be boosted because of how Slayer is". Slayer, as it is right now just isn't balanced. At all.
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  • #2
    Forums timed out while I was making my lengthy post so will finish it tomorrow. I agree with most of what you have to say, and it reminded me that I had missed a few bits myself.

    I don't agree with making classes on par to Slayer because certain aspects of it are so obviously, ridiculously broken that it would do more harm than good to try and compete.

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    • #3
      100% agreed

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      • #4
        If you want to know what end game VM can do, take a look at Repede's VM videos of S3 devildom solo runs in under 7 minutes. That's a broken class, with the sadism nerf in full affect.

        If they nerf VM then by all means nerf slayer a bit - but as it stands, end-game VM wipes the floor with kill speed and damage in s3 devildom. Tell Jordan he needs to learn to cast and move, then run mobs through blinds, snares etc as well as the huge VM aoe.

        Evasion doesn't seem to work all that well, so removing sfp and leaving a slayer with 50k hp unbuffed won't make for a fun class, just a dead one. As soon as your evade fails and a stun or two hit, you'd be dead. Changing threat reduction would be pointless- why do you want to send mobs away, unless you think we should be pulling one mob at a time- which would make most quit the class.

        Unless you seriously think a slayer's role should be back at one pull at a time in s3, whilst a VM can wipe the room in under a minute?

        Bear in mind not everyone has access to godly buffs when suggesting huge reductions in HP pools.

        Also bear in mind that people will rebirth as soon as you nerf a class too much. There's a reason not many players played slayer before- without great buffs, pieces, high level gears, etc it was a very slow leveller and not much fun to play when other classes could level 10 times faster. Even less played it when it was a puller in hidden dungeons (I was one of those pullers!) and there is no point driving people away again.
        Classic quotations: No issue here. Closing this thread.

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        • Hitsuyga
          Hitsuyga commented
          Editing a comment
          CSM: Stop comparing classes
          JB98: VMVMVMVMVMVM

          I keep seeing you mention Repede, but his vid was only half a run. A full run would take 15 minutes-ish. Much slower than a full DP. My guild DP managed a 5:30 min run last night. His solo vid was cool, but not that efficient. He also had buffs which are no longer available..

          I must say, I'm loving how terrified you are at the idea of a slayer nerf, considering what a massive .... you were when the VM nerf came through.

          We have a section for VM, perhaps keep slayer section about slayers..

        • JustBrowsing98
          JustBrowsing98 commented
          Editing a comment
          Well done on the 5.30 run. What were your main dd's? What drops did you manage to get? Solo without HH buff takes me 29 minutes at present as I'm missing the set bonus. You split the drops by 8? How do you divide up the black boxes?

          Perhaps ask Repede how long a full run takes now- those job level boosts are huge.

          I'm not terrified of a slayer nerf- stop with your emo comments. If they nerf slayer, I'll just RB to VM.

          And comparing classes is exactly what BALANCING is all about...

      • #5
        So.... My first class in 2006 I believe was my Slayer Gaulie. I rebirth her a couple of years back since I was tied of dying so quick into a VM. Built then my new Slayer Rusian and it's fun to play Slayer again.
        i would really want to keep playing this game but worry it will again make me take a few years break as many times before

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        • #6
          Originally posted by CantSeeMe View Post
          It's also not supposed to be a tank. ...... .Slayer shouldn't be taking agro, it's not a tank. People need to get out of this mind set.
          No disrespect to you at all, since everyone is entitled to their opinion which is what this is all about, But i want to point out that I've been tanking for groups on assassin since epic 4, all the way through epic 5 I tanked almost every Takin party I was in. So in my mind assassin is and always has been a tanking class. We had less hp than a knight by about 3k in early epic 5 they were hitting around 15k, but we had the same hp as a Soldier, my assassin was at 12k, holding aggro was not a problem with oblivion off, but there were people who could grab it off me if they tried too, and i think that's how the group dynamic was intended to be. The main reason we were a less desireable tank is because our p.def was much lower compared to the knight and we put extra strain on the healer...
          Last edited by Laraki; 01-10-17, 02:41 AM.

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          • #7
            Originally posted by Laraki View Post

            No disrespect to you at all, since everyone is entitled to their opinion which is what this is all about, But i want to point out that I've been tanking for groups on assassin since epic 4, all the way through epic 5 I tanked almost every Takin party I was in. So in my mind assassin is and always has been a tanking class. We had less hp than a knight by about 3k in early epic 5 they were hitting around 15k, but we had the same hp as a Soldier, my assassin was at 12k, holding aggro was not a problem with oblivion off, but there were people who could grab it off me if they tried too, and i think that's how the group dynamic was intended to be. The main reason we were a less desireable tank is because our p.def was much lower compared to the knight and we put extra strain on the healer...
            agreed and that strain was not something small either...

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            • #8
              Many comments are intresting but as if slayer loses all its hp altho yes its bit too high for scalingon a offensive stats (patk) which is kill speed that it will get retarded just buy getting higher weps and awake ect. But taking it all would just destroy it all. Eva means little to nothing endless you can some how have crazy limiteless funds. When everyone can become buff whores yes everyone will go crazy. I still think buffs should all be toggles but stronger but nit remained after leaving party to prevent that kind of loop hole. Bring back when being anything other then hard glass or dd tank would mean somthing. Patk/matk in slayers is bit too high since every attack or magic dmg class rush that period. But slayer id asuras war they need some durrability since eva means nothing endless yoy max it out like people treate crit pow. But making sfp be for pacc... slayers would be trashed again like when cube was new. Rebalancing is not the same as just nerfing. Need to bring many classes ratios up for hp or survivability in bits so its not wars have 4x hp as all other classes. Pvp its just a game of tag and who jumps first. Eh... ether way game will not change by one or too changed other then yellow text from rebirths. Need over all work not just one here and there. So many forgoten classes labeled as trash or slaves. Need to fix this personaly or the big issues will just rotate as it has always done. We players have options with belts bosses sets ect. Theres always a wierd way around changes.

              Rambled a bit sorry ^^ just think game should do more for all classes after a certain point for ever its been one class is the problem over and over since forever. Least johnsin isent around to rebirth every week anymore... o.O

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              • #9
                How about leveling the classes up instead of nerfing classes? There's an idea....

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                • #10
                  How about we keep on topic and understand the glass cannon was already upgraded to the great wall of china, which was absolutely unreasonable

                  Slayer should get some HP due to it's lack of P.Def, but they have huge amounts of Evasion to compensate. No class should even approach a million Max HP

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                  • #11
                    I am 100% agree with CSM

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                    • #12
                      agreed with CSM, 9.2 slayer was perectly fine, if anything they needed a HP nerf back then, but instead Devs give the class a huge boost

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                      • #13
                        I couldn't agree more.

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                        • #14
                          less HP ok , but what with not working skill 0% activate wtf ? ( after image )

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                          • #15
                            even after 3 iteams still 0% chance

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