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  • [Suggestion] Scout Rework

    This topic is more like about major Scout overhaul as the things that I'm going to suggest here will illustrate the true meaning of scout (in my opinion). There are many things that I thought about reworking scout to be more like a strategic class. Below I'm listing the changes that I believe will make from him more defined.

    First of all, the current class name, Scout, should be changed to Engineer for the reasons that he is specialized in executing traps. The upgraded version of Engineer would be Exploiter as he utilizes his skills to destroy enemies through their weaknesses.

    The class should also be fully WIS based but retain other physical like skills that could be charged with magical power.


    New Skills/Skill changes!

    *Change Fire Support to Outburst (AOE non elemental damage with explosion effect)

    *Add skill as passive: High Frequency Active Auroral Research Program or HAARP for short ; It changes Outburst to 4 different elemental skills according to Elemental Charge used.

    *Add 4 different Elemental Charges (Buffs); Fire (Burn) + Air (Stun) + Ice (Freeze) + Earth (Slow)

    *Change Flame Trap to Tracking Mine (affected by Elemental Charge)

    *Change Pumpkin Bomber name to Explosive Grenade (affected by Elemental Charge)

    *Change Honed Blades to Honed Explosion (replace Physical Attack % increase with Magical Attack % increase)

    *Bomber Shot becomes non elemental by default but affected by Elemental Charges


    *Skill affected by Elemental Charges:

    *Engineer's signature skill Outburst (previously Fire Support) changes to :

    -Ice Dust (Water damage)- Freeze (AOE Warden Frozen Step)

    -Shockwave Pulsar (Air damage) - Stun

    -Thermobaric Detonation (Fire damage) - Burn

    -Macroseism/ Temblor (Earth damage) - Slow


    *Tracking Mine (previoiusly Flame Trap):

    -Combustion (Fire damage)

    -Thunderbolt (Air damage)similar to Elementalis's Lightning Bolt

    -Icicle Shower (Ice damage) similar to Warden's Blizzard

    -Tremor (Earth damage) similar to Maiden's Full Charge Buster


    *Add 2 more traps in addition to the current ones with changes in their effect:

    -Fire Trap (Explosive, burn effect)

    -Earth Trap (effect similar to Battle Maiden's Round Blast)

    -Ice Trap (effect similar to Warden Frozen Flasher)

    -Air Trap (effect similar to Gunslinger's Electric Shock)


    *All other physical skills changes to magical when charged with Elemental buffs

    *Claymore becomes fully Magical skill


    *Skills to be removed:

    -Remove STR passives.

    -Remove Fire and Frost Weapon buffs (to be replaced by Elemental Charges)

    I know there are people who'd say that Scout doesn't need to be changed or other stuff because there are classes that need to reworked/rebalanced and I'm aware about it very well but I came up with these suggestions to be part of future improvement for this class. And I already explained the reason why this class needs to be reworked in the beginning of this post. I would like to hear constructive feedback and hopefully Webzen will make the necessary changes based on our suggestions.


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  • #2
    Ehhhh
    I think it should be not changed to either full wisdom nor full str.
    And you are talking about mainly pve i assume ._.
    I think they should add double turn slash, chain strike cancel, swallos touch and make available to combo after the groundhouse kick.

    Your suggestions sounds cool tho =o but i like it old school. They should rather make a new class called "engineer".
    Cheers for the suggestions mate!

    Comment


    • #3
      Originally posted by BomberScout View Post
      Ehhhh
      I think it should be not changed to either full wisdom nor full str.
      And you are talking about mainly pve i assume ._.
      I think they should add double turn slash, chain strike cancel, swallos touch and make available to combo after the groundhouse kick.

      Your suggestions sounds cool tho =o but i like it old school. They should rather make a new class called "engineer".
      Cheers for the suggestions mate!

      I assume you are PVP player and probably sided with STR one, but my suggestions here serve both aspects of the game if you consider the additional effect from elemental additions (Freeze, Slow, Stun and Burn). And yeah, I know this class doesn't have many combo options and I personally like to mix between melee and magic skills. That's why I suggested to make Elemental Charge changes physical skills to magical ones once activated (not only elemental damage but the actual WIS damage just like NS and Erta) and I believe that's possible. Adding more melee skills you suggested doesn't hurt to make him more fun in PVP.


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      Comment


      • BomberScout
        BomberScout commented
        Editing a comment
        Scout has a lot of combo options.
        But only a very few *long* combo options aight.

    • #4
      Changes like these are very unlikely to be made. From what I see it's just like making an entire new class. In the best case they would change some frames/effects in Scout's rework, but something like this? I think it would be better to make a new Hunter class based on elemental weapons and skills.

      What I would like to see for Scout's rebalance (talking about PvP) is not only to improve his utilities (that are the worst among all the classes), but also to change the nature of his lag-friendly skills. I'm still not sure how to make this work out well, but lately I got some new ideas for Scout's rebalance:

      Skills rework:

      Find Weaknesses - becomes fully SA-framed

      Fire Support - becomes fully SSA-framed

      Explosive and Freezing Trap - they turn into stationary, non-moving skills. In exchange they gain 3x more AoE. That would encourage players for active usage of air traps (not just planting them and hoping for enemy to get close) and dramatically reduce lag factor. They could be the real thing to trick your opponent together with passive "Camuflage" (described below)
      EDIT: I take back that part about instant explosion. On the second thought, that would be too OP with AoE increased 3 times.

      Freezing Trap - gets a chance to freeze enemy (the higher level, the higher chance)

      Chain Strike - becomes cancelable with command skills while enchanted by Fire/Frost buff

      Groundhouse Kick - ending animation gets reduced to the point it can be used as a connector in a combo.

      Bursting Touch - gains short dash, similar to Gunslinger's Gun Crasher. Breaks guard and has iframe on initiation and dash (no more safe backpedaling against Scout). Explosion hit can not be countered with evasive attack. Every next level of the skill increases the range of dash.

      New skills:

      Improved Crouch - new passive skill for Scout. Extends the time of Crouch stance by 3 seconds, allows to move twice faster in it and gives a short iframe on deactivation. If someone thinks it's too good, as well this skill could have 5 levels. Then you get 0,5 second of additional Crouch stance per level (starting from 1 second on level 1) and 20% of additional movement speed per level.

      Camuflage - passive that gives all the traps 80% of transparency so they sometimes would be diffucult to spot for enemies. This way they could become REAL traps by definition, that is attacking opponents when they don't expect it. The owner of traps can still see them normally.


      I still don't know how we could change Flame Trap and Lethargic Mist to reduce their lag factor. Maybe something else will come to my mind.

      Comment


      • #5
        Originally posted by DoubleBone View Post
        Changes like these are very unlikely to be made. From what I see it's just like making an entire new class. In the best case they would change some frames/effects in Scout's rework, but something like this? I think it would be better to make a new Hunter class based on elemental weapons and skills.

        What I would like to see for Scout's rebalance (talking about PvP) is not only to improve his utilities (that are the worst among all the classes), but also to change the nature of his lag-friendly skills. I'm still not sure how to make this work out well, but lately I got some new ideas for Scout's rebalance:

        Skills rework:

        Find Weaknesses - becomes fully SA-framed

        Fire Support - becomes fully SSA-framed

        Explosive and Freezing Trap - they turn into stationary, non-moving skills. In exchange they gain 3x more AoE and they explode immediately after they detect the target (without the usual short delay). That would encourage players for active usage of air traps (not just planting them and hoping for enemy to get close) and dramatically reduce lag factor. They could be the real thing to trick your opponent together with passive "Camuflage" (described below)

        Freezing Trap - gets a chance to freeze enemy (the higher level, the higher chance)

        Chain Strike - becomes cancelable with command skills while enchanted by Fire/Frost buff

        Groundhouse Kick - ending animation gets reduced to the point it can be used as a connector in a combo.

        Bursting Touch - gains short dash, similar to Gunslinger's Gun Crasher. Breaks guard and has iframe on initiation and dash (no more safe backpedaling against Scout). Explosion hit can not be countered with evasive attack. Every next level of the skill increases the range of dash.

        New skills:

        Improved Crouch - new passive skill for Scout. Extends the time of Crouch stance by 3 seconds, allows to move twice faster in it and gives a short iframe on deactivation. If someone thinks it's too good, as well this skill could have 5 levels. Then you get 0,5 second of additional Crouch stance per level (starting from 1 second on level 1) and 20% of additional movement speed per level.

        Camuflage - passive that gives all the traps 80% of transparency so they sometimes would be diffucult to spot for enemies. This way they could become REAL traps by definition, that is attacking opponents when they don't expect it. The owner of traps can still see them normally.


        I still don't know how we could change Flame Trap and Lethargic Mist to reduce their lag factor. Maybe else something will come to my mind.
        Everything is great but making Find Weakness fully sa would be too op, people could do e grab > find weakness > get hitted by enemies rising and still combo them with -20% def (i forgot extact number) more like semi sa so that some skills wont break it and no projectile (except piercing projectiles ofcourse) and if we're talking about lag factor Freezing Trap is also one of those traps and that trap which shoots darts + the one which shoots bullets backports you
        Rest than that are really god plain buffs +1 from me

        Comment


        • #6
          I don't think it would be too OP. Considering its turtle-speed animation, low range and high cooldown, SA would be the only way to make it usable in the middle of close combat without getting punished in 75% of cases. When it is used in a combo, in my opinion if Scout managed to burn your evasive dash and get you into the e grab, you just deserve to get debuffed. If after that you use evasive roll instead of rising attack, Scout still has to catch you again within 20 seconds to make a use of this debuff.

          Freezing Trap - yes, I mentioned this too and suggested to be stationary together with Explosive Trap. Regarding turrets (line and spinning), I don't think something can be done about them or even should be done. These bullets are no different from usual projectile, so their lag factor is also not worse (unless you stand right at the Spinning Turret and it keeps teleporting you back).

          Comment


          • #7
            Okay, maybe I got this! I think I know how to reduce the lag factor of Flame Trap and Lethargic Mist. It's very simple to implement.


            Lethergic Mist - damage gets increased 3 times and the frequency of hits gets decreased 3 times

            Flame Trap - damage gets increased 5 times and the frequency of hits gets decreased 5 times


            You get the concept? With lesser hit frequency these skills will lose a lot of their ability to drag opponents back into them. And that's not all. This will also make them stronger in PvP. Less hits = less combo damage reduction. PvE should stay unaffacted by this change.

            Comment


            • #8
              Originally posted by Seraphiel View Post
              This topic is more like about major Scout overhaul as the things that I'm going to suggest here will illustrate the true meaning of scout (in my opinion). There are many things that I thought about reworking scout to be more like a strategic class. Below I'm listing the changes that I believe will make from him more defined.

              First of all, the current class name, Scout, should be changed to Engineer for the reasons that he is specialized in executing traps. The upgraded version of Engineer would be Exploiter as he utilizes his skills to destroy enemies through their weaknesses.

              The class should also be fully WIS based but retain other physical like skills that could be charged with magical power.


              New Skills/Skill changes!

              *Change Fire Support to Outburst (AOE non elemental damage with explosion effect)

              *Add skill as passive: High Frequency Active Auroral Research Program or HAARP for short ; It changes Outburst to 4 different elemental skills according to Elemental Charge used.

              *Add 4 different Elemental Charges (Buffs); Fire (Burn) + Air (Stun) + Ice (Freeze) + Earth (Slow)

              *Change Flame Trap to Tracking Mine (affected by Elemental Charge)

              *Change Pumpkin Bomber name to Explosive Grenade (affected by Elemental Charge)

              *Change Honed Blades to Honed Explosion (replace Physical Attack % increase with Magical Attack % increase)

              *Bomber Shot becomes non elemental by default but affected by Elemental Charges


              *Skill affected by Elemental Charges:

              *Engineer's signature skill Outburst (previously Fire Support) changes to :

              -Ice Dust (Water damage)- Freeze (AOE Warden Frozen Step)

              -Shockwave Pulsar (Air damage) - Stun

              -Thermobaric Detonation (Fire damage) - Burn

              -Macroseism/ Temblor (Earth damage) - Slow


              *Tracking Mine (previoiusly Flame Trap):

              -Combustion (Fire damage)

              -Thunderbolt (Air damage)similar to Elementalis's Lightning Bolt

              -Icicle Shower (Ice damage) similar to Warden's Blizzard

              -Tremor (Earth damage) similar to Maiden's Full Charge Buster


              *Add 2 more traps in addition to the current ones with changes in their effect:

              -Fire Trap (Explosive, burn effect)

              -Earth Trap (effect similar to Battle Maiden's Round Blast)

              -Ice Trap (effect similar to Warden Frozen Flasher)

              -Air Trap (effect similar to Gunslinger's Electric Shock)


              *All other physical skills changes to magical when charged with Elemental buffs

              *Claymore becomes fully Magical skill


              *Skills to be removed:

              -Remove STR passives.

              -Remove Fire and Frost Weapon buffs (to be replaced by Elemental Charges)

              I know there are people who'd say that Scout doesn't need to be changed or other stuff because there are classes that need to reworked/rebalanced and I'm aware about it very well but I came up with these suggestions to be part of future improvement for this class. And I already explained the reason why this class needs to be reworked in the beginning of this post. I would like to hear constructive feedback and hopefully Webzen will make the necessary changes based on our suggestions.


              its totally too much unnecessary work... might as well make a new class @.@
              too much changes make it doesnt even feel like scout

              Comment


              • User1
                User1 commented
                Editing a comment
                also ... making 4 elemental dmg is kinda absurb cos you wont be able to do ur dmg to the fullest unless all scout have poe

              • User1
                User1 commented
                Editing a comment
                seems like combining skills from other classes ==

            • #9
              (Would you like to see your favourit classe killed by a total rework? for my part NO.
              STR scout is fking awesome, can be played full infinite combo. Is 100 time more strategic to play in pvp than the spam trap and run in pvp.
              It's OFC one of the most weak class, because It suffered a lot from *Rakhdan counter attack* rebalance, with many STR skill nerfed, and almost none were buffed.
              A lot of player think it cannot be played in PVE, without even trying it. While i did a lot with it. First team to clean bardiel on EU, Second to get full tertis set. getting rank 8 when there were player like EternalFlames, Intro, Snakette, Bambi, Theokoles, Shikki, Lara... on top rank.
              The STR way was ofc not the most OP class, but was ok.
              Almost every class was buffed, get some frame changed since and with *Rakhdan counter attack* patch. They just forgot STR part of scout.)


              Why i don't want to see wis scout buffed? because it's actually the most ridiculous class played by player with high ping in PVP.
              With a yellow ping opponent, you just cannot move from lethargic mist, when you dodge traps, you still take hits sometime more than 500ms after and get pulled back like 5m.

              This proposition for a total rework sound more like killing a classe to make a new one.

              As some alredy told, maybe just let scout were it is, stop killing STR part of it and do a new class with what you proposed would sound better imo.
              __________________________________________________ ______________________________
              ************** THANATOS - French Guild - Rakhdan (EU) **************
              __________________________________________________ ______________________________
              [VL]DevilDriver is also N2h2, Deadstrider, DevilDriver², BL☆CKST☆R.
              Copy and past thoses in game name if you need to contact a VL on EU server.

              Comment


              • #10
                rather than so much rework... add more utility skills and str based skill so that player can play either play full wis or full str efficiently ....

                Comment


                • #11
                  Sounds more like a male version of elementalist... but almost well rounded one... I guess

                  Comment


                  • #12
                    traps are bugged on scout.. if you use Flame Trap and that trap kills an enemy.. Flame trap is not going to search for another enemy.. keep there.. doing nothing... same with line turret...

                    Comment


                    • #13
                      The only way to fix this class in pvp is to remove all knock back from traps and add a few skills to the class like a dash, so it can get close to ranged classes...

                      Comment


                      • #14
                        grab, guard break n frame

                        Comment

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